Does anyone else feel that Capitalism is the most insidious and destructive of all the modern cancers?
ItsSteveDave | August 9, 2012 - 16:17
Yeah, but apparently you can't just say that any more, you need to have an angle, otherwise it's the same old arguement and people tell you to stop moaning and get on with it. God I want to punch those people.
tan63 | August 9, 2012 - 16:35
At least we're no longer obliged to define the fucking thing before we punch them. There's progress.
ItsSteveDave | August 9, 2012 - 17:06
"I really hate cancer, I wish it could be removed from the earth"
"Please explain cancer to me"
"Then how can you hate cancer? You can't even explain what it is..."
*SMACK* right in the chops.
Stan | August 9, 2012 - 17:25
Not only is it the most insidious and destructive - it is also the cause of all modern cancers.
FTSE100 | August 9, 2012 - 17:50
I've tried a dozen ways on these forums to shake people out of their slumbers. They just snooze on.
I'm not that thrilled about getting worked up about a word, though. How do you know who you're fighting? When you walk down the street, how do you identify the capitalists? Where are they? Who are they? Give me names!
You could send everyone who works in Docklands to the guillotine, I suppose. Would that end capitalism? You could blow up the Houses of Parliament. Would that do the trick? You could murder anybody who earns more than you do. Would that fix it?
How would you know when capitalism had gone? Would money disappear, for instance? Would I get more of it? Who would give it to me? Or would I just have to content myself with the knowledge that the capitalists were no longer helping themselves from the honey pot, but that the leaders of the People's Realm of Eternal Loveliness were getting it all instead?
Once you tell me who we're fighting and what the end result will be, I'll join you on the barricades. Give me names! Give me a clue what I can look forward to in the new world! Give me hope!
The Walrus | August 9, 2012 - 18:01
I have the names and addresses of the capitalists locked in a safe deposit box somewhere in Milton Keynes, all thirty five and a half million of them. Probably. I will release them for a cool five million quid, because I am, like most people, a very jealous, secret would-be capitalist. But don't tell anyone. Please.
tan63 | August 9, 2012 - 18:23
ftse - I wouldn't want you on my bleeding barricades if you hadn't already worked out what you were doing there, by yourself, already. Stupid.
FTSE100 | August 9, 2012 - 18:24
tan - I'd know why I was there. What I wouldn't know was why anybody else was.
You have to take people as they are, I suppose. Nobody wants to think very deeply (i.e. at all) about anything. If you want the support of the masses, give them a slogan to fight for.
Did the French ever get liberty, equality and brotherhood? Having fought for it, you'd think they'd have taken the trouble to find out whether they'd got any. Or was it just another corporate mission statement?
Down with capitalism, cunt and other bad words!
Will anyone join me in putting an end to cunt, by the way? Don't ask me what it is, I'll just get angry. It's a bad thing and the root cause of everyone's problems, okay?
tan63 | August 9, 2012 - 19:40
ftse - Fair comment, nigger
The Walrus | August 9, 2012 - 19:46
But I like it. A lot, in fact. Cunt, cunt, cunt, cunt, cunt. See? What other words do you consider to be bad? Knacker sack? Cauliflower? Beeswax?
If I ever become filthy, stinking rich I intend to build a delightful cunt shaped castle in the heart of the Cotswolds out of black and white marble and pink Bordeaux limestone, the exterior walls decorated with fine carvings of Jeremy Clarkson, Simon Cowell, Piers Morgan and various members of parliament and engraved with the word 'cunt' over and over and over again, quite discreetly as a whole but in huge, bold italics on the side overlooking Ed Miliband's twee little cuntry cottage.
If you liked apple pie and strawberry blancmange, garden gnomes, monkey puzzle trees, tatty old orange and white Volkswagen campers or spam fritters (or maybe all of them), wouldn't you feel a bit peeved if some mustached, jackbooted fascist wanted to ban them all forever and hack the hieroglyphics of their former existence out of the collective unconsciousness with a blunt chisel?
White Dwarf | August 9, 2012 - 20:14
Yeah.. Castle Cuntmore -- I put dibs on designing the water features.
*slips back into his slumber like a good consumer*
Stan | August 9, 2012 - 20:33
Cunt is one of my favourite words. It's much underused, in my opinion - though James Naughtie made a good stab at it on Radio 4 when referring to a Tory MP. A Freudian slip if ever there was one.
I suppose most 'isms' are cancerous. Communism, fascism, monetarism, rheumatism, astigmatism, jism. When I think of capitalism, though, I think: Rupert Murdoch, Philip Green, Bob Diamond, Mitt Romney, Milton Friedman, Lloyd Blankfein. There's a few cunts whose faces I'd like to slap a bit.
But why, when they've all created so much wealth? 'Cos most of it has been for themselves... and fuck you, Jack. Shouldn't'a bought a sub-prime mortgage for blue-collar-High-School-diploma-small-town you and your fat stupid wife and rancorous spawn in the first place, should ya...
Yes, I know.... any system is open to corruption... yes...
The Walrus | August 9, 2012 - 21:28
'Castle Cuntmore' - now why didn't I think of that? I suppose I'll have to build lots of deep, dark, warm, moist, musk scented cunt shaped dungeons with lacy curtained, pube lined entrances for imprisoning complete cunts in. But wouldn't that be, well, not exactly a punishment? Wouldn't it increase the crime rate?
And it means I'd have to pay a selection of scabby, preferably leprous gaolers to dish out maggoty, cockroach infested slops (available from McDonalds and all good supermarkets and delicatessens) and hose down the inmates every few weeks. Or months. Maybe I should simply feed all even vaguely cuntish felons arrested in the Independent State of Cuntville to the pigs or grind them up for fertilizer and not bother with the dungeons. Well, maybe just the one.....
Please send all designs for Castle Cuntmore's numerous water features and the long anticipated Golden Shower room (preferably extremely graphic ones) in plain brown envelopes marked 'Cunt-tastic, Sperm-squirting Porno Filth' to PO Box 666, Walsall, West Midlands.
I shall, of course, carefully consider all entries. When the missus is at work, obviously, because like all fascist dictators she despises my love of all things cunty, and if she finds out I'm history.
The prize for the competition winner is two weeks full board in Castle Cuntmore's only dungeon (as long as the winner agrees to bleach it thoroughly when they've, you know, finished) and a pair of Nancy Del'Oilybits used knickers - sorry, no one else agreed to provide their sweaty scanties apart from Ethel Merman, Kerry Katona, Sylvester Stallone's mum and Professor Stephen Hawking.
Stan | August 9, 2012 - 22:15
Can I stay in the Castle's Lingham Tower.
Priapism... that's another cancerous 'ism'.
FTSE100 | August 9, 2012 - 23:06
Since nobody knows who or where the capitalists are, the standard way of finding out is to start a riot and see who turns up to fight you. If you are anti-capitalists, whoever tries to stop you smashing and looting must be the capitalists.
If the police turn up, they must be the capitalist police. If the local residents try to protect their property, they must be the capitalists.
FTSE100 | August 10, 2012 - 04:05
Created wealth, Stan? Created wealth? What the hell does that mean?
No doubt those people have done something. Creating wealth certainly wasn't it.
Redistributing money is not the same as creating wealth. It isn't a subtle distinction. Not only are the two not related, they haven't even got any mutual friends on Faceboook.
Stan | August 10, 2012 - 12:25
That's what I meant when I said most of it was for themselves, Footsie. My tongue was planted firmly in between my molars and the side of my face! Personal wealth, as opposed to common wealth... which I take it is the true meaning of 'commonwealth of nations'. If so, then why is Canada - a commonwealth country, with our Queen as head of state - doing so much better than we are. Why don't they send some of it over here? Eh?
FTSE100 | August 10, 2012 - 14:04
Whoever is closest to the honey pot will always help themselves from it. It's human nature.
If somebody told you you were worth ten million a year, wouldn't you be only too happy to believe it? And to return the compliment? How long before you were convinced that you and your friends had rare and exceptional talents and deserved every penny of your remuneration?
We are all bankers at heart. All we're missing is the bank.
ItsSteveDave | August 10, 2012 - 14:35
FTSE, I do agree with your opinions on these matters to a large extent, but are you saying there is a solution to these shortcomings of human nature? I mean, human nature is the only impediment between here and utopia, isn't it?
Will we always have to work around human nature, or can we change it?
If it can't be changed, then we might as well nuke China and let the whole thing come to its logical conclusion, and hope that in a few million years when little humanoid things evolve they don't fuck it up quite as comprehensively as we have.
Stan | August 10, 2012 - 14:58
John Travolta was once asked how he could justify getting $20 million a picture. He said 'It's the going rate'.
I wouldn't know what £10 million a year would be the going rate for. Being pretty good at football, I guess - yet it wasn't so many years back that it would be a tiny fraction of that amount. When Hugh Jones won the London Marathon in 1982, he went back to Ranelagh Harriers and his town-planning studies. Nowadays, he'd be up in the stratosphere, probably earning more than the GDP of some developing countries.
I suppose I'm trying to say... how is it ever decided what any individual is 'worth'? Is there a ratio between 'net worth' and 'moral worth'? If you made a huge fortune by exploiting cheap labour and polluting the seas and then ploughed it all back into philanthropic projects - would the 'good' of the one cancel out the 'bad' of the other?
What's for tea?
FTSE100 | August 10, 2012 - 20:10
Given the flawed nature of people, it's amazing we've got this far. Such a short time ago it was considered acceptable in Britain for leaders to boil people alive or hang them, cut them down before they were dead and - you know the rest. That stuff you 'did' in history lessons - just think how recent it all was. The people living at the time, people just like us, wouldn't have seen anything strange about it. What's familiar is right.
People in those days didn't think, "we're only history lessons, nobody will believe in us anyway, so nothing we do really counts. I mean, look at us, we haven't even got Twitter. We shit in the bushes. Who could ever take us seriously?"
There's part of the answer. How you behave is strongly influenced by the narrative you were brought up with. We've all seen the undrclass on TV, indignant that the police should use trap houses because nobody can resist pinching something that's in plain view. "Everbody does a bit of fievin'." They believe it, too.
The other part of the answer seems to be that you restrict people's freedom as much as possible. At work they follow a strict and highly circumscribed routine. Outside work the police are there in case anybody strays too far from acceptable behaviour.
The problem is, there are certain groups who are free to behave as they like. They are often brought up with an entirely different narrative. They are told that they are exceptional people whose destiny is to rule, or at least to be wealthy. They believe it just as readily as their opposites believe in fievin'. They believe it is their right to act without restriction. Often they are not very bright (Cameron? Boris Johnson!) They fuck things up for everybody else.
In time they will be engulfed. They are no longer as free as they would have been a century ago. Some of them really do go to prison! Not enough, but some. It's a start.
It isn't a case of quis custodiet ipsos custodes. The thing that will be doing the 'custodieting' will be a set of rules, not a superclass.
That's my prediction, anyway.
tan63 | August 10, 2012 - 20:31
Did any of you define human 'nature' before branding us all the same?
FTSE100 | August 10, 2012 - 20:48
The day you turn down your ten million I'll believe you are fundamentally duifferent, tan.
Of course I'm not saying that everybody is the same. On the other hand, we all want something. If it isn't bling and consumer goods, maybe it's to be popular or respected or - who knows?
I have a feeling that Gandhi wouldn't have found poverty half as appealing without an audience.
Stan | August 10, 2012 - 23:05
Good point, Footsie. Though if somebody offered me 10 million tomorrow to do with as I will, I'd still give it to people who need it more than I do. I could still claim Jobseekers' Allowance that way, after all.
FTSE100 | August 11, 2012 - 06:39
Funny you should say that, Stan. I've always felt I needed ten million far more than you do. Maybe we can work together on this?
tan63 | August 11, 2012 - 15:32
ftse - you seem to be judging things only in terms of money. money is merely one of many value systems. It's only a means of bartering and trading and has nothing to do with 'human nature'. Greed and violence didn't come first, so to speak.
FTSE100 | August 11, 2012 - 21:28
I'm just being a good capitalist, tan. I deserve my ten million. Everybody in my boardroom says so (as long as I say the same about them.)
If the topic of this thread was human nature, I'd say that nobody ever reads the instructions or the FAQs. That seems to be pretty universal! But I expect there are exceptions to that rule too...
You might not believe it, tan, but we're on the same side. There's a lot of bad shit going down that I'd like to put a stop to. The thing I have my doubts about is calling it 'capitalism' or, as someone on these forums did a while back, 'democracy'. It's too vague. It doesn't home in on the places where the bad stuff is going on and the people who are doing it. It's like declaring yourself to be against evil or sin. Very worthy and all that, but where do you even begin to fight it?
marionwozere | August 12, 2012 - 13:11
Antioxidants, they're meant to be good for cancer...and what about those flavinoids...we could with some of them too...One of the anti-cancer supplements I regularly use is laughing and shouting at the television particularly when adverts for women's beauty products are on...I'm not sure how much this has shrunk my tumour but I feel a lot better...
Click the button to donate to ABCtales.com!
Stay informed of our latest news!
© Copyright 2000-2007 Burgeon Creative Ideas Ltd, and the members of ABCtales.com. All rights reserved.
drupal site development by computerminds
original site by John Handelaar