You can't stand in the same river twice.

13 posts / 0 new

Topic locked

Mon, 2001-07-30 15:48

A few weeks ago I used the above phrase 'you can't stand in the same river twice' in a thread entitled 'Who's who? started by Roy Bateman on 8th July. Then I went away and forgot about it. Having a few idle hours to pass today I was browsing old threads and totally unknown to me there's been a bit of discussion re this phrase (by Jennifer, Robert, Sid Arthur, IFB, Andrea).

When I used it, it was just something I remembered from way back so I had to check. Apparently it was first used by a Greek philosopher called Heraclitus. Obviously I can't speak for old H. but I've always took the phrase to mean that everything changes and whilst you might imagine you're doing the same thing, actually you won't be. Obviously the river is a metaphor for life and hence my reference to me having the same name but not being the same person. Or as Bob Dylan put it in his great, and much-overlooked, song 'To Ramona' -

Everything passes, everything changes,
Just do what you think you should do,
And who knows baby,
One day maybe,
I'll come and be crying to you.'

Personally I see this all this as Buddhism by another name so I guess Sid Arthur will probably understand. What do you reckon, Sid Arthur or should I say Sidartha. Or are you actually Herman Hess using an alias? Which brings us nicely back to Who's who.

By the way, who is Rig Veda?

PS. Apparently what Heraclites actually said was 'You can't STEP in the same river twice' but it amounts to the same thing, wouldn't ya say? Also, apparently, there has been much philosophical discussion about what H. actually meant but it seems pretty clearcut to me. Anybody got any other ideas? When H. was going on about all this stuff, Jenny, he omitted to mention your horses.

Tue, 2001-07-31 08:48

mississippi

Oh well, perhaps I'm dumber than I thought. It's these ':-)' things, I don't like 'em and always think they are typos!

Tue, 2001-07-31 09:25

john L

I bet Heraclites wishes he'd never even said it in the first place. He'd probably been down the Rat and Toga and had one too many Retsina Shandies. You know how it is don't you? The more pissed you get, the more profound you think you are. Or maybe him, Socrates, Aristotle and Plato had parked their charity in a quiet country lane on the outskirts of Athens and were sharing a quiet spliff. Suddenly Heraclites had this massive 'insight'. 'Yer know, lads, yer can't actually step into the same river twice.' 'I dunno, H' replies Aristlotle 'What if the river is flowing at 3000 cubits per sundial and your horse can gallop at 4000 cubits per sundial. Etc., etc. etc.' Then they all giggled like little schoolgirls. After a while Socrates says 'This ganja is a bit weak. I think I might try some of that new-fangled stuff. What did you say it was called, Plato? Hemlock. Cool, man. Pass the goblet then.' And the rest, as they say, is history. Or pure fiction, as the case maybe. You choose.

Wed, 2001-08-01 13:30

Karl Wiggins

John, I like your style.

Wed, 2001-08-01 14:07

John L

Cheers, Karl. You are the bloke who wrote 'High on Kai' ain't ya. In which case I like your style too mate but did you really have to go and make us all feel so sad. Except then I got happy again just thinking about getting 'High on Kai.' Incidentally, for what it's worth, I gave 'KAI' a 4*. Would have given you more but there's not a 4.75 option is there and I ain't the kind of bloke who believes in perfection. Bin around too long. My guess is you ain't the kind of bloke who believes in perfection either. By the way seeing as you like my style, you wouldn't by any chance happen to be 35 year-old tall, willowy, nymphomaniac redhead who owns a bar in Grand Bahama just using a pen name to fool everyone, would you. No. I thought not. Just my luck. See you around.

Thu, 2001-08-02 15:27

Karl Wiggins

John, Thanks for the 4* for "High on Kai". It's appreciated, and I'm going to make a definite effort to read your own work tonight. Unfortunately, I don't own a bar in Grand Bahama, but I do own one in the Seychelles. I'm a 35 year old nymphomaniac with blonde hair, big tits and long legs. Not your type at all then. Never mind.

Thu, 2001-08-02 16:57

John L

Well, like we said - nobody is perfect so I guess that will just have to do. My entire body of 'work' on ABC consists of one 'poem' entitled 'What my Dad told me about drugs in 1965' and is filed in the Opinion section. It's not a real poem, its kind of sentimental doggerel but for some reason the few people who've read it seem to like it. I wrote it almost by accident in about five minutes flat when the idea just occured to me. To be honest it kind of wrote itself and, boy, can you tell.

Mon, 2001-07-30 16:02

the professor o...

What about: You can't step into the same river once ?

Mon, 2001-07-30 20:05

mississippi

Ok, if the river is flowing at say 3mph. and average walking speed is 4mph. and you walk downstream for 3 hours and then wait an hour, you can step into the same damn water as you did 4 hours earlier. So what's the problem?

Mon, 2001-07-30 20:18

#10

robert

ever thought of taking up horse riding, mississippi? :-) maybe there is a combined equestrianism / literal thinking course... anyway, the composition of the water would have changed due it its coursing against the riveranks an bed, so it wouldn't be the same...aha! my interpretation is the same as john's, i think, that you you cannot recreate an event or your experience of an event

Mon, 2001-07-30 21:02

#11

mississippi

Oh dear Robert, I was taking the PISS don't you realise? Am I wasting my time trying to be entertaining?

Mon, 2001-07-30 22:52

#12

Karl Wiggins

It's not the river that has changed. It's your mind that has changed. That's a load of crap, isn't it? I wish I hadn't written it. How about this: You can't step in the same river twice because your foot will have changed. Every second billions of cells are exterminated and billions of cells are created. Blood will have flowed through the veins and arteries in your foot bringing with it migrating oxygen particles. It's your foot that's changed. The river will (hopefully) still be the river thousands of years after you've finished your earth walk.

Tue, 2001-07-31 00:45

#13

robert

i know, M! so was i, hence the :-)

Topic locked