I can't imagine the world without me

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Tue, 2006-09-19 15:29

markbrown

I can't imagine the world without me

Hello folks,

have we all seen 'It's a Wonderful Life'?

It's a heart warming film about debt, depression and deciding to top yourself.

If you haven't seen it, the main gist of the plot is that a man decides that he's let everyone down in his family and town, with no money and no way to give his family a good christmas. He decides that he should jump off a bridge, because the world would be better off without him.

An angel then shows him what his town and family would be like if he hadn't been born. he realises that, far from never making a difference to those around him, many things that he took for granted would never have happened without his being alive.

What do you reckon the world would be like without you? Choose a point where you influenced events then think about what would have happened if you hadn't.

We all secretly wish that we've made a big difference to the world around us and all secretly fear that we haven't.

In the end of 'It's a Wonderful Life', the protagonist finds out that the world was a better place for him having been born, and that lots of people were glad that he was in their lives rather than not.

I'm sure that's true of all of you as well.

It's up to you to choose where your divergent timeline begins.

So, what's the world like without you?

Cheers,

Mark

Tue, 2006-09-19 16:12

yan

My daughter wouldn't have been born without me; that's a fine achievment in itself. Some things are deffo worth sticking around for. All those girls who would never have felt the sweet, soft caress of my lips on their bodies...I could think of more..OH YES! The world loses out without me around. I'm glad I'm here bringing joy into so many lives. There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennet

There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed -
Dennett

Tue, 2006-09-19 16:21

Jack Cade

The only thing I can think of is that certain people may well have never been introduced to certain other people, and thus many fine friendships may never have happened. There could be ricochets off those events, I guess. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

Tue, 2006-09-19 17:22

span

There would be more buttons available to other people. I love them, My siblings would have bigger egos. And like JackCade, there would be people unintroduced. Which would be a shame. My closest friends would not recieve odd things in the post. Span

Tue, 2006-09-19 17:35

markbrown

It's not an easy question is it? If I hadn't been around, there's a good possibility that my sister would never have gone to university. If she didn't go to university, she wouldn't have lived in London, wouldn't have gotten the life she has now. If I hadn't been around, I wonder whether my mother might lived a bit longer. I don't have any concrete evidence for this feeling, but I can't get away from the sense that I, in some way, contributed to her dying so early. I wonder whether a friend who tried to kill himself when we were teenagers would have made that step if it wasn't for me. We were two weirdos together, so I wonder if that let him travel further down a certain path further than was healthy. I think there would have been a few people along the way who might have ended up more ill and a few who would have ended up far more healthy. I seem to have brought a fair amount of complication along with me where ever I've been. It's hard to judge whether that's been a good thing or a bad thing. Cheers, Mark

Tue, 2006-09-19 18:29

rokkitnite

I know for a fact that, without me, there would be at least one little boy who would not exist. He's not mine, I hasten to add... but I played an essential part, nonetheless. Aside from that, hmm... tricky. I'd like to think I've been a subtle force for niceness in many people's lives, without necessarily having massively changed them. That makes me feel happy.

Tue, 2006-09-19 18:56

maddan

A friend of mine would definitely not have met his wife, and since I've spent a good part of our friendship dissuading him from listening to dismal midle of the road music and she is an enthusiastic indie rock fan, they may not have even got on that well if they did meet. Three short films would never had been made. After several years of work I've been trying to think if all of the products I've worked on would have still been made. I imagine the companys would have muddled along without me.

Tue, 2006-09-19 20:35

archergirl

Mark, you seem to be carrying around an inordinate amount of guilt and self-blame for events over which you actually had little control. Have you had or considered having counselling for such things (and I absolutely do not mean that in a facetious way; counselling's the best thing to happen to me yet...)? Blaming oneself, no matter how abstract the consideration of blame is, is not healthy! Isn't all of this a sort of 'fallacy of ultimate responsibility'? 'A Wonderful Life' was a very nice, sappy film, but it seems to me to be a moot point; if I had never existed, then everyone who would have met/known/been influenced/hated/loved/etc. me would simply have had some sort of existence where having me in it would never have mattered. Arrgh, it gets all twisted around in me head, if I think too long about it! I'll go finish the ironing instead!

Tue, 2006-09-19 21:01

Mr.Hiding

It's very easy to imagine the world without you archergirl. you see all i have to do is remember what it was like here a couple of years ago.

Tue, 2006-09-19 22:18

#10

yan

Yes Mark! Being a weirdo doesn't drive someone to suicide; I don't think I've ever heard of that symptom before. And all children lead their parents to earlier graves...it's children for ya! :) But sometimes (despite your odd perception) it's healthy to confront the problem head-on instead of propping yourself up with positive affirmation and lame excuses because it's a selfish way of (temporarily) supressing the invevitable breakdown. If you were partly to blame then face it, get it out of your system and then soldier on DUDE! I think that the greatest achievment I ever made was to bring light and love into so many lives - friends and strangers alike. But I don't like to talk about it. I'm like the Beatles...I just spread the love. There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennet

There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed -
Dennett

Wed, 2006-09-20 12:24

#11

markbrown

Yan, Archergirl, you misunderstand. You make the assumption that to feel that you may have had a negative impact in the world must be taken as a sign of crippling guilt. I've come to terms with things amply, thanks very much. Admiting culpability doesn't necessarily mean that you are failing to be optimistic, or that you are sinking into despair. Accepting mistakes is the only way to move forward, I reckon. Cheers, Mark

Wed, 2006-09-20 12:42

#12

yan

That's what I said! There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennet

There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed -
Dennett

Wed, 2006-09-20 12:43

#13

ivoryfishbone

i prefer to imagine it without certain other people ...

Wed, 2006-09-20 13:45

#14

pepsoid

Although there have been some negative perceptions, itâ€™s so good to see people responding positively to this â€“ itâ€™s so therapeutic! Of course, there is the causal-paradoxical point that AG raised, being that if I wasnâ€™t here, then no one would be aware of my not-here-ness, therefore it wouldnâ€™t matter whether I had been here or not(another PKD moment, methinks!); howeverâ€¦ Whether or not my own existence has generally had a positive effect on the world, I always like to try and make the effort â€“ when I can; and when I feel confident enough â€“ to â€œspread the love,â€ offer any (hopefully) helpful little snippets of wisdom I might have, etc. I frequently worry that I wonâ€™t ever achieve anything â€œuseful,â€ but then I think about the Butterfly Effect and all those little grains of positivity I have sent out into the world, and everything seems okay again! Obviously the world would be a much sadder place without Larry & Mickâ€¦ :-) ~PEPS~ [ insert pithy and poignant quote ]

The All New Pepsoid the Second!

Wed, 2006-09-20 16:48

#15

poetjude

On several fine Saturdays a small group of fortunates would have to do without a damned fine cup of tea. jude "Cacoethes scribendi" http://www.judesworld.net

Wed, 2006-09-20 16:48

#16

poetjude

...oh and fig rolls. jude "Cacoethes scribendi" http://www.judesworld.net

Wed, 2006-09-20 17:04

#17

yan

I wondered whether, when we were five, if I'd stopped and had a long conversation with my friend, I might have delayed his life enough for him not to have been murdered 13 years later. There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennet

There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed -
Dennett

Wed, 2006-09-20 17:22

#18

hox

Without me....... My ex would probably spit less My friends would probably laugh less My enemies would probably care less The great slipper shortage of 1979 would never have happened My Godson would still be lying in a majorcan gutter, puking. Shares in Cadbury would be sharply down.

Wed, 2006-09-20 17:29

#19

archergirl

You taught your ex how to spit?

Wed, 2006-09-20 18:00

#20

cath_carr

Three daughters wouldn't exist, Martin's English would still be exercrable, my mother wouldnt be grey and my father wouldnt be bald. Stacie wouldnt laugh half as much as she does, Malboro Lights profits would be halved and the young boy down the road would have ten more footballs more than he does.

Thu, 2006-09-21 13:57

#21

Mr.Hiding

Ditto pepsoid.

Thu, 2006-09-21 15:25

#22

pepsoid

Ditto Mr H. ~PEPS~ [ insert pithy and poignant quote ]

The All New Pepsoid the Second!

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