Although he's broken the law of no more than three a day, I am so pleased to see Steve Button back again. I wish he'd post more. All at once, a treat. Check some out.
http://www.abctales.com/story/steve-button/hamster-chronicles
How ironic. I was just about to start a thread about him. Rats, you got there first.
The above poem is a blinder. Matter of fact. Full of natty turns of phrase (putting up a hamster fight). Economic. Bursting with clarity. Disciplined focus on theme.
I'm just not sure about that last line. I'd get rid of it. The line preceding it would be a cracker to end on -- it's like Steve felt he had to apologise for that unexpected callousness, but it's something a lot of people can relate to. Confidentially, about human beings too.
Overall, she's a pearler.
I'd also snip "to match my cartoon life". It seems out of the blue to be honest, and a bit corny. I do very much like the guilt over the goalpost. Very idenitifiable.
"I have a room for life at the Home for the Chronically Groovy."
I don't think the point is to care about the hamster. It's, IMO, to care about or relate to the narrator.
In the first verse I empathised with him -- losses are intensified during childhood ; they are uncomfortable memories. Pets probably have the highest frequency, closely followed by elderly relatives. Most of us will know where he's coming from.
In the second verse I related to him -- when I lost one of my grandparents, I barely felt a thing. I had that "dead inside" feeling. His thoughts gave me the squirms of recognition.
But get rid of that last line!
Sean Playfair,
Just what is IMO? (GRRRR)
Please does:
'My last experience of death
was less drawn out,
the way things seem to be as we get older.'
really do it for you? After this line he is back with the pets.... (purile). Why is he touching on and avoiding other things which sounds as if they could be a lot more interesting?
'I came home one night after drinking away
some feelings I didn’t want anymore,'
It's a pity he drank them away, I may of been able to relate to them and him.
'See the fly on the wall. squash! Fuck all.'
Will that get me a cherry?
IMO In My Opinion
I thought this was good, it would be better without the last line. However, it doesn't really stand out as something that demands more reading. I agree with Chris, the subject matter was a bit too peurile in parts for me although I suspect this is intended effect - to communicate the sentiments we feel in childhood.
My main gripe however is that their is nothing hidden behind the poem. Subtleties like the fact that this was a gift from his ex aren't subtle enough. It communicates everything it is supposed to in one read. So I read it, think 'okay, I get that' so why read again?
jude
"Cacoethes scribendi"
http://www.judesworld.net
"My main gripe however is that their is nothing hidden behind the poem."
I couldn't really care less if there is or there isn't. I got more from it than a tale of pet mortality woe...but what else is behind there is up to Steve anyway. Anyhow, give me a clear, resonant muse over a-poem-about-a-grapefruit-really-about-the-futility-of-the-human-condition debacle any day.
"'See the fly on the wall. squash! Fuck all.'
Will that get me a cherry?"
Probably not on its own, but it's a promising start. Keep working on it.
When Steve gets over the loss of his furry four legged friend, I feel sure he'll get around to the death of that grapefruit. (is that what you had in mind Sean?)
Talking of sub-sub-sub-text:, I once had a spider, too -- maybe I can get something together with my fly line! Yep, I can feel another human epic tragedy in the making....
Yours
Flyless
"'I came home one night after drinking away
some feelings I didn’t want anymore,'
It's a pity he drank them away, I may of been able to relate to them and him."
You might have been but then you would've been reading a different poem about something else.
"My main gripe however is that their is nothing hidden behind the poem. Subtleties like the fact that this was a gift from his ex aren't subtle enough. It communicates everything it is supposed to in one read."
That's difficult to say unless you know what it's meant to communicate. It asks enough questions for me as a reader to justify a few reads.
There's a problem of people thinking that when a poem doesn't include obvious elements which say 'look at me I'm writing a clever poem' that it doesn't involve depth or technical skill.
The mastery of language in this poem is superb. The imagery is extremely precise.
I could say a lot more about this.
For the record, I've read it about seven times. And every time, it was -- with you here, Buk -- a delicious lesson in poem writing and englishgrasp.
Chris: "Why is he touching on and avoiding other things which sounds (sic) as if they could be a lot more interesting?"
Who knows? I guess that's the poet's perogative. The things left unsaid. But you admit it's not just "puerile" then...there's something behind it all?
Hey Jude! Read again...
And Chris, why are you so angry?
And, on a pedantic note, why do you say "I may of" as opposed to the much favoured "I may have"?
Sean you misinterpret (as many do) my irony or passion for anger. Actually I can't stop laughing. Maybe you could please point out how you came to your conclusion. Anyway what have you against anger? 'anger is an energy' is it not? Or do you go in for suppression?
'I may of'. North English colloquial, like 'git', as in ‘you git!’ Dear me I hope this isn't going to turn into one of those boring discussions on English usage and silly rules, or worse, one of those class war threads which seem so popular here.
Aware or unaware to the writer, there is always a sub-text. It's just a matter of finding the bugger (a less favoured use Sean).
Mmmm, Did T. S.Elliot kill off any of his cats?
The Lone Groover
"Sean you misinterpret (as many do) my irony or passion for anger."
If you have "a passion for anger", Chris, then I'm not far wrong in assessing you as "angry"...I didn't misinterpret anything, I asked "why are you so angry?" which, in a roundabout way, you've admitted you are.
I am Northern, and working class, and I can tell you categorically that "I may of" is NOT Northern dialect: it's a misspelling/mishearing of "I may've"...all round the country. Though I admit it was a bit wanky of me to pick up on it. But I don't like your tone: which is tantamount to, "This is a stupid poem about stupid dead pets and my stuff's better so why can't I have more cherries wah wah wah."
The sarcastic comments would be better supplanted by more constructive criticism.
And it's a really fine poem. Everyone thinks so apart from a couple of bitter grumps.
So there.
Okay, I have actually returned to the poem several times and it is growing on me! I am often wrong and often make mistakes. thanks!
jude
"Cacoethes scribendi"
http://www.judesworld.net
Hi Sean,
Who is angry? Calm down, keep taking the tablets and don't ride a bike. But please, do try to smile a little.
"But I don't like your tone: which is tantamount to, "This is a stupid poem about stupid dead pets and my stuff's better so why can't I have more cherries wah wah wah."
1. Why should I care what you think about my tone? Whenever I’m in the face of the absurd I revert to humour.
‘Humour is the true liberator’ – Henry Miller
2. I've haven't once mentioned my work. Pure speculation and projection on your part Sean.
3. Cherries? get a life!
4. I’m amused at your failed attempts to pursued me and everyone in the whole world of the poems merits. I will try (if you are sitting comfortable) to explain why the poem doesn’t work for me.
Poems work for me by pushing buttons of all kinds, which open unexpected doors in me. Which seems wonderfully to happen by auto-magic. – vital process. A poem must intrigue and/or enhance and/or nourish me. What you don’t seem to understand Sean is the word SUJECTIVE. Hence you want to speak for everyone when you say in your above confessed pedantic (and is all to see in the limerick thread) way,
'And it's a really fine poem. Everyone thinks so apart from a couple of bitter grumps.'
But, I didn’t think we have heard from everyone have we?
There is FOR ME more not-ness than is-niss in this poem. Where the writer supposes I the reader am involved with his sorrow, I am only laughing.... The use of a hamster ‘A HAMSTER’ only conjures up for me that old TV series of ‘The Young Ones’. Where the hamster (SPG) is always getting flattened and stuff, or ‘The Dead Parrot Sketch’ by the Monty Python’s team. I’m sorry, but I just can’t take the death of the hamster seriously.
Your enthusiasm for the poem will not change my mirth or those images in my head. So there only remains to say, that rather I, or the poem, or neither is to blame – you can, and have took your pick. I believe when I read a poem I go the necessary 50% of the way. And I think I have with this one. So it’s enough to say the writer and myself do not meet in spirit. But that is not enough for you is it Sean. You are behind your barricade in your bunker brain insisting that your one vertiginous, poker-dot idea is the only possible one. And if someone doesn't agree they must be bitter grumps.
You say,
'I am Northern, and working class, and I can tell you categorically that "I may of" is NOT Northern dialect: it's a misspelling/mishearing of "I may've"...all round the country. Though I admit it was a bit wanky of me to pick up on it.'
Sean, I was brought up in the slang-ist dock land slums of Hell (sic) which sits on the River Humber (up shit creek), on the East Yorkshire Coast, and I can assure you, if you can just rein in and get down from your pedantic high horse, that ‘I may of’ is indeed used there. Whenever I return, as I have recently (I have lived in Berlin for many years), I find myself falling back into it. But, your wankiness doesn’t bother me anyway.
Con amore
THE LONE GROOVER
PS
The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction’
William Blake
"Why should I care what you think about my tone?"
No reason why you should ; just explaining my behaviour, and how you were getting under my skin.
"Cherries? get a life!"
Come come now. Would you honestly have the jury believe you don't care about cherries? If so, why this comment:
"'See the fly on the wall. squash! Fuck all.'
Will that get me a cherry?"
If cherries are not an issue, why mention the fact this has one in such a scornful way? Yes it is speculation -- that you're harbouring some bitterness about not being cherried enough, and that's affecting your judgment -- but it's correct speculation, isn't it? Let your guard down. We all have a jealous streak.
"(and is all to see in the limerick thread)"
In that thread, I was defending myself against a coward hiding behind an ID created mainly to piss people off on the forums. I thought at first it was a genuinely ignorant member with a bit of a mouth taking me to task on something I know a lot about and he/she knows little about. I acted appropriately, with rational explanation and argument. There was nothing "pedantic" about it, as dumbo was so far off the mark.
When somebody pointed out this person was doing it for the kicks -- and the next post was so full of holes and risible tripe -- I finally decided nobody could be THAT stupid (though a modicum of stupidity clearly exists in that brain) and ignored it.
"But, your wankiness doesn’t bother me anyway."
Could have fooled me.
"'The tigers of wrath are wiser than the horses of instruction’
William Blake"
I've met my match, here. If you're able to quote Blake, you're obviously much cleverer than me, so I'll say you've won the argument.
Hi rek02.
glad you could join us two boys. Can I take it you're a girl then, smacking our wrists like that? Can I also take it that your above civilising comment nontheless agrees with me that 'A HAMSTER'(or two)is not exactly -- how shall I put it? -- an inspiriting symbol? Soory if mine and Sean's little knock around banter was not as entertaining as we thought. But that boy....!
Hi Sean,
how much more reasonable you sound... But I see you are still having a spot of bother with your speculation and projecting syndrome, which obviously has a side effect of loss of sense of humour... Ho maybe your ability to detect irony was never strong?
ME: "Cherries? get a life!"'
YOU: Come come now. Would you honestly have the jury believe you don't care about cherries? If so, why this comment:
ME: "'See the fly on the wall. squash! Fuck all.'
Will that get me a cherry?"
YOU: 'If cherries are not an issue, why mention the fact this has one in such a scornful way? Yes it is speculation -- that you're harbouring some bitterness about not being cherried enough, and that's affecting your judgment -- but it's correct speculation, isn't it? Let your guard down. We all have a jealous streak.'
ME: (Hi jury who's on trail?)
YOU: 'We all have a jealous streak.'
ME: That maybe true Sean, but please don't put a hunger for cherries in my streak.
(see my comments on cherry picking thread.)
Well Sean, it has been nice talking to you.
May I be so bold as to ask (it has been on my mind a lot)if your name (playfair) is unfortunate, or just an aka?
Yours playfully
THE LONE GROOVER
I'm not a girl. I didn't think I had to be a girl to call you two boys.
What I meant by my comment was that this seems to be an awful lot of discussion about what seemed to me a poem about a dead hamster. But it's a good poem about a dead hamster.
Oh, and keep the final line. It's almost like a disclaimer, something that often crops up in conversation after someone has said something that they might want to defend. Quite an authentic touch.
"I have a room for life at the Home for the Chronically Groovy."