Believe Systems

Do I believe in predestination? No I don't, because to believe that would mean that I believe that whatever situation a person ends up in is inevitable, and that it would have happened no matter what factors were in play in their life. Some things cause other things, but causation is often a very complex business. I'm not a big fan of fatalism. "Oh, it was always going to turn out like that." Not necessarily. Cheers, Mark

I'm with Mark. Our actions can often have completely unforeseen effects - sometimes in areas where we least expect them. The actions of a government or a major corporation can have similiar unforeseen consequences. But those are part of the vagaries of the human condition and they are normally explicable, after the event. Fate and/or predestination would take away these things. It would mean we would end up by explaining history as 'it was always going to happen that way'. That is not so! If Hitler had not engenderd the Reichstag fire then he would not have come to power, the second World War would not have happened and the world would be a very different place. Lots of other stuff would have happened instead! Our actions DO have consequences. Fate is just a term for explaining the inexplicable but as knowledge increases more and more becomes explicable. Whether we learn from it is another matter.

Don't let your fate escape you jrc.

Everyone has to believe in something. I believe I'll have another drink.

When speaking about the evolution of species, there may be an inclination to say that everything is as it is because it got that way. A circular argument, by any definition! One can speak of destiny in similar terms. History has followed one single path of possibilites. It may be that everything that has happened so far (in the history of the universe) could not have happened any other way... but how would we know? The inevitability of things cannot be proven or disproven, because we only have one timeline from which to draw for evidence - the one we are living in. Are all things pre-destined? Maybe. But as there is no way I can know this, it should not in any way affect my actions. pe ps oid ... What is "The Art of Tea"? ... (www.pepsoid.wordpress.com)

Takes me back, this. Well, nature is malleable, but may have a law which doesn't permit full harness. If so then, yes! Fate operates in a chaotically-organised manner. From a purely human-centric viewpoint, fate boisters will. The two, working in tandem, are very powerful natural assets. Which doesn't mean to say that they are 'real', just as we wouldn't believe, after watching a movie, that it had 'really' happened. But the feelings of solace, direction, or inspiration the movie gave us, in way of dealing with real life situations, was, or is. A word, derived from a wish to express a 'belief' or even a 'feeling', that has proved successful in mans' relationship with the universe. There for the taking - taken - rewarding - affirmed. But always in conflict with cynicism. Faith acts to defend against such. When the power of love overcomes the love of power, we'll find peace. - Jimi Hendrix

‘Our actions are like ships which we may watch set out to sea, and not know when or with what cargo they will return to port.’ Iris Murdoch The Bell

I think Daniel Dennett's theories on determinism are really excellent. It is hard to swallow the idea that really we are creatures controlled by biologival imperetives and freewill is an illusion. Dennett argues that the illusion is so strong and convincing because it has to be in order for the system to work. Our belief in free will is a necessary part of the ordered system we belong to! His book Elbow Room: The Varieties of Free Will Worth Wanting (1984) is really good and the wikipedia entry on the book is an excellent summary. He concludes that neither determinism or indeterminism are solutions to the free will problem. He also argues against quantum indeterminism and argues that determinism does not rule out moral responsibility. I think it really is the best book on the subject by a long long shot! jude "Cacoethes scribendi" http://www.judesworld.net

everybody has their share of tears and laughter. feel that? that is the only place where we feel the need to incorprate fate,predestination in our beleif systems. otherwise it is a lie tht we lose control of our lives because were destinied to do so. destinies are born from strong and intense beleifs.