In Pursuit of Laziness

Well, the past is a foreign country, and I've already said on this thread that it's pretty obvious that Westerners have more wealth and luxury than ever before. So I wouldn't say it's 'worse'. But there is more at stake. Technology does accelerate things. I don't believe there has ever been more impoverished people in the world as a whole, nor more people at risk from the disastrous mismanagement of resources that results from the greedy minority. "The Taoist can lead a life that can seem effortless because it is well ordered. He can appear to be spontaneous because he has a solid framework in which to live." So in other words, Taoism actually advocates hard work in the present as beneficial in the long term. Do Taoists, like Zen Buddhists, also believe there is something to be gained from applying yourself to even the most mundane task? I find this attitude a lot more admirable than the view Peps seems to share with the very Capitalists he's against - that we should only work for immediate material reward, and when we've got enough, we should sit around and congratulate ourselves for having removed the need to work. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

slothful said: 'It's all well and good to dismiss the ideas of Taoism as being overly simplistic, but how can a life spent working in a job you at best tolerate to buy tonnes of goods that you don't need, be a better philosophy? For self-indulgence I think the west wins hands down. ' Too right. There's more to life than 'things' and the more 'things' you own the more time and money you have to spend maintaining them because 'things' just end up breaking. Life may appear to become easier but technology introduces so much superfluous junk into our lives that we have to work harder to keep it good. 'Things' are like caffeine - they lift you up temporarily and then drop you and leave you wanting more. Begin again! Round and round and round. Enter the wisdom of many religious paths. Focussing on the inner you rather than reaching outside of yourself for 'things' in the mistaken belief that they will provide lasting happiness. 'So in other words, Taoism actually advocates hard work in the present as beneficial in the long term.' I wouldn't say that Taoism advocates 'hard work' specifically but encourages people to hop and skip over life's worries, dealing with them mindfully as they occur and being aware that many problems, as you said, are illusory. Shit does happen and some people, in a perpetual pursuit of happiness, make life harder for themselves by treating life's downs as unfair or unjust or underserving, and will end up making themselves miserable by trying to suppress the bad. Everything (all the bad and good) should be embraced equally and dealt with mindfully. The vineager tasters sums tao up perfectly. Here is it: The vinegar they are tasting represents the essence of life. The first man has a sour look on his face, the second wears a bitter expression, but the third man is smiling. Why the difference? To Confucius (left), life seemed rather sour. He believed that the present was out of step with the past and that the world would be a much better place if there were strict rules. Confucius emphasized a strict order which ruled the affairs of all in his land. Anything that did not fit into the established order was considered bad. The second figure (middle) in the painting - Buddha - considered life on earth to be bitter. He saw this world to be filled with attachments and desires that led to suffering; a setter of traps, a generator of illusions and a revolving wheel of endless pain. In order to find peace, Buddha maintained that it was necessary to transcend this world. The Buddhist sees the path to happiness constantly being interrupted by the bitterness of this world. Lao Tzu is the third man (right) in the painting. According to Lao Tzu, the world was governed by the laws of nature, not by those of men. He maintained that the more man interfered with the natural order of things, the more out of balance the world became. As things became unbalanced, trouble followed. Lao Tzu is smiling because sourness and bitterness comes from the interfering and unappreciative mind. Life itself, when understood and utilized for what it is, is sweet. That is the message of The Vinegar Tasters. I suppose this is where some of the 'idler' philosophies come from. Out of all the eastern ways, tao was one that was never embraced fully in the west. The reason why? Because it offered no ultimate reward! (no afterlife, no nirvava, etc.) Which says alot for the west...lol There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennett

"But there is more at stake" What is at stake? It is enough of a challenge in life to reconcile oneself to ones *own* actions, without running round 'saving the world'. What arrogance! Get your own shit together first, innit. Fix up, look sharp!* Enzo.. Read my rubbish novel as it happens! http://somesolitude.wordpress.com/ *none of the above was directed at any individual in particular.

"What is at stake?" People's lives. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

"Do Taoists, like Zen Buddhists, also believe there is something to be gained from applying yourself to even the most mundane task?" I think they both would agree that there is nothing to be gained from such application. Which is exactly why it is worthwhile. You do things for the pleasure of doing them, not for what you gain from them. I think if we would apply ourselves lovingly to all the little tasks of our own lives (and I include in these our interactions with others) we would forget our obsession with the 'problems of the world that we have to fix'. Often these problems are just in our minds.

If you are wondering where these 'new' people are coming from then this link will explain all: http://www.idler.co.uk/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1610 Hmm, slothful refers to Jack Cade as a cunt. Not such a nice chap after all, is he?

Hmm. Coming back from that forum, I repeat: Feh! Surely this kind of argument is only valid for singletons, childless people, or those who have someone else there, doing the chores for them. Usually a woman.

I like it. I have enough trouble keeping up with this thread, now I've got to nip over to idler too :) Suppose I'd best nest-in... :) Could someone fetch Henry the horse There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennett

And Dr. Heckle, you need to take my picture off your page, right fucking now.

Wu We - I want one of those for Christmas if I can't have a PS3 jude "Cacoethes scribendi" http://www.judesworld.net

Yeah, here's what some kid over there has to say: "Why the fuck would you want to have more than enough you stupid cunt?" It's another case of 'I never said that'. I said that I admired the ethic that working on anything, no matter how mundane, whether or not for a reward, is worthwhile, rather than working just for material wealth. I've spent a good deal of this thread objecting to people who grab more than they need and defend that activity on the basis that they've 'earnt' what they have. You've got to be pretty stupid to conclude that I'm arguing otherwise. But that fits because most of what's said on that other forum's thread *is* pretty stupid. "I think they both would agree that there is nothing to be gained from such application. Which is exactly why it is worthwhile. You do things for the pleasure of doing them, not for what you gain from them." Well, the 'pleasure' could be seen as the gain, but basically, I think we're on the same ground here. Working for working's sake is a positive attitude that has nothing to do with keeping us enslaved. Consumerism is driven instead by the ethos of 'working for money so you can buy things and feel good'. Pepsoid's attitude is exactly what a capitalist government wants from its people - the desire to stop working and rest on your laurels, preferably with toys and games and other distractions that must be purchased. So the message is "Work hard for us and then you will have that as your reward. Work and you get to buy. Work and you get to retire," Such a message is ineffective if you work because you believe working is a good thing, rather than for the promised 'reward'. So, Peps, you've got the whole thing the wrong way round. "I think if we would apply ourselves lovingly to all the little tasks of our own lives (and I include in these our interactions with others) we would forget our obsession with the 'problems of the world that we have to fix'. Often these problems are just in our minds." Often, but not always, by any means. There are many practical and real problems that should not be forgotten. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

'Working for working's sake is a positive attitude that has nothing to do with keeping us enslaved. Consumerism is driven instead by the ethos of 'working for money so you can buy things and feel good'.' Jack, I agree with this. I might add the stipulation that a certain amount of work is driven by material necessity (and by this I mean paying the rent and having food on the table); however, one can approach this pragmatically without becoming overwrought about the evils of consumer enslavement. I think this is what the Taoists on the thread are saying, as well. There has to be a balance between 'work' and 'not work'; it's not a question of 'do nothing'; it's a question of 'doing' with a balanced attitude.

"Often, but not always, by any means. There are many practical and real problems that should not be forgotten." I think you're right, we are on the same ground. And the zen approach to these problems would be to just take care of these problems rather than pretending that they don't exist. The classic of Hinduism, 'The Bhagavad Gita' has a good perspective on this. One should do what needs to be done. but at the same time, one not be attached to the rewards. I'm not quite sure what if any disagreement is going on on this thread. It seems like it has something to do with work ethic. Those words seem to have a stigma attached to them, reminding one of the puritan American blindly labouring away, turning the pristine country into a theme park, and threatening to do the same to the rest of the world. Maybe there is a certain responsibility to consider whom one's work goes to serve. Some work is better not done like market research or corporate law, But it is dangerous to generalise even about that.

To summise: I don't think anyone is saying that working 9-5 is great and healthy, that consumerism or capitalism is tip-top, or that people who relax and enjoy life are idle. No one is saying we should suffer more. That's for certain. I think everyone here would want what AG calls "'doing' with a balanced attitude'. Some people are arguing *against* this particular straw man though - chiefly the people from the other forum - because they're polarised and see everyone who disagrees with them as being at the opposite end of the scale. The argument Pepsoid put forward is that believing hard work to be a virtue strengthens and supports capitalist dogma, and is a device used by 'captains of industry' to try to extract more productivity from us. The opposite argument, which, it seems, both Taoism and Zen thinking are in favour of, is that work for work's sake is a healthy attitude, that we can enjoy application as much as relaxation. Personally, I think we do need a work ethic in this country that places more emphasis on home life. It's absurd to think of people's jobs as the only work they have to carry out, and as such, I think most employers squeeze far too much. It does verge on nightmarish in a lot of jobs. It's shit. It doesn't help the planet either. But I think the whole 'importance of being idle' argument is part of the problem. The people who are laziest are the ones who end up in most danger of being absorbed into the system, because they'll only put the minimum amount of effort in. In this country, the minimum amount of effort, in the case of the middle classes, usually equates to doing a low responsibility 9 to 5 office job and occasionally tidying up. You consume with the money you earn, and you keep doing it til you retire. You put up with your job, and you enjoy the evenings and weekends...mostly. I think generally the more industrious, hard-working people are the ones who are more likely to end up doing jobs they believe in, or want to do, or even working for themselves, because they're prepared to do far more than the minimum. Doesn't always hold true, but as RadioDenver illustrates - anyone who feels they enjoy a good balance of work and leisure also feels they got there because they put in more work than the slackers. Edit/caveat: On examination, it looks like there's only two people posting from that forum, and 'slothful' is the only one who seems polarised. So I apologise for my generalisation. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

'the minimum amount of effort, in the case of the middle classes, usually equates to doing a low responsibility 9 to 5 office job and occasionally tidying up. You consume with the money you earn, and you keep doing it til you retire. You put up with your job, and you enjoy the evenings and weekends...mostly. ... generally the more industrious, hard-working people are the ones who are more likely to end up doing jobs they believe in, or want to do, or even working for themselves, because they're prepared to do far more than the minimum'. Ooo, Jack, I was going to disagree with this, but then you said: 'Doesn't always hold true'. Certainly doesn't. Sometimes there really is no other option, even for the hardest-working. Not when one has two kids in primary school, for example. I'm one of those people in a 'low responsibility 9 to 5 office job', when really what I'd like to be doing is a 'job [I] believe in, or want to do', which is public health programmes in Africa. But when one is faced with the choice of doing best for oneself, or doing best for one's kids, there's not really much of a choice, if one wants to be a good parent. I'm just not willing to sacrifice my children's wellbeing on the altar of my idealism. There are all sorts of reasons people 'settle' for less than what they want, and it's not always about minimum effort.

Yeah, that was precisely why I added 'Doesn't always hold true'! I looked it and though, "Ugh. That could be read as a rule of thumb, which is not what I mean." No, I'm very much aware, as per the Uni dicussion, that there are people who work incredibly hard and still end up doing one of those jobs, and also people who want nothing better than that sort of work (though I think they're few and far between). But what I would say is that idlers will gravitate towards these kind of jobs. In your case, you do it because your priorities are rightly elsewhere, leaving little energy for hunting down better job opportunities (and little room for risky job-hopping), but in theirs (this is awful generalising again, but hopefully people will follow my point) it's because they just don't believe in applying themselves to *anything*. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

'Idle hands are the Devil's workshop'.

k, we all done in here? peps - wanna start another topic? hehe There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennett

Aye! And Buzzcocks at 10. Don't think Bill Bailey is gonna last long with the new set-up, though. There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennett

Goes to show dunnit. Why do all orifices have a signature smell - except for ears? There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennett

Mr Cade I hereby apologise if my comment on the Idler forum caused you any ill-feeling or distress...it was mainly for comic effect and a bit of melodrama... I believe good rational arguments, if taken in the right spirit, can expand the mind and help us all find some truth in life.

OK, apology accepted. I'm sorry about flying a bit off the handle about it as well. What tends to work me up most these days is being totally misread, and the idea that restless acquisition and hoarding of wealth is a good thing is about as far away from my views as possible! ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

Jack Cade said: "...restless acquisition and hoarding of wealth is a good thing...[in]...my view...." God I've been bored since I finished NaNoWriMo. Enzo.. Read my rubbish novel as it happens! http://somesolitude.wordpress.com/

Hey I'm sleeping in tommorow, judge me if you want lol.

"selling their souls to filthy lucre and rampant consumerism."?! Well of all the.............!!! .........er......how much are they paying, anyway?

"Some of the comments which disparage laziness were deeply troubling...servile brown-noses who reveal their lack of substance by selling their souls to filthy lucre and rampant consumerism. I feel profound pity for those of you who embrace the yoke of the corporations..." There's no need to feel pity. You're far more likely to have to bear the yoke of corporations, and to sell your soul for lucre and comsumerism, however grudgingly, because your own laziness will prevent you breaking free of such servitude. Hard-working people are more likely (though as we've already said, not by any means guaranteed) to end up doing jobs they'll enjoy, or feel are important, maybe even working for themselves. Slackers are fated to man the phones and booths for murderous banks all their lives, and buy tonnes of junk to console themselves. Your attitude is the heart and soul of rampant consumerism. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

There's no need to feel pity. You're far more likely to have to bear the yoke of corporations, and to sell your soul for lucre and comsumerism, however grudgingly, because your own laziness will prevent you breaking free of such servitude. Hard-working people are more likely (though as we've already said, not by any means guaranteed) to end up doing jobs they'll enjoy, or feel are important, maybe even working for themselves. Slackers are fated to man the phones and booths for murderous banks all their lives, and buy tonnes of junk to console themselves. Your attitude is the heart and soul of rampant consumerism. This smacks of ingrained work ethic and utter snobbery. There are plenty of hard-working people manning the phones and booths...and plenty of slackers managing them. People who buy into this propaganda are entirely at the mercy of the corporations because they perpetuate the myth that hard-work elevates you from the wretched masses. Your good engineering jobs and the like are just as meaningless as those positions you deem lowly and meaningless. The only difference is that they pay a little more...for now. Far from preventing you from breaking free from servitude it will only yoke you to it more through the lure of the rewards of perceived power, perceived control, wealth and status. Plus the more you put into the system the harder it is to escape from it...'my job is my life' as opposed to 'it's just a job'. As for consumerism, it stands to reason those with the most income spend the most money...unnecessary home renovations, holiday properties, decadent holidays, electronic gadgets by the bucket-full, every manner of extra-curricular activity to instill the work-ethic and a competitive advantage into their children, new cars, indulgent feeding at restaurants...need I go on.

This takes me back to 1992. I'd left school and was making the most of the summer before starting college. There was a bunch of us, stoned, sprawled on the carpet of Nick's flat listening to Bongwater. Nick was paranoid about how his speakers were positioned so he kept crawling to them and adjusting their angles. He always got pride of place dead-centre of the stereo field. Guppy peers up every once in a while, clears the long hair from his face, looks at me with sunken eyes, a lazy smile and says, "hear that bass?" Guppy's a bass player and after a while he pipes-up, "I need a new bass. Might get some part-time work for a few weeks." Now you NEVER mentioned the words "part-time work" in Nick's flat. Last time that happened Nick dropped his pants, sat on the banister in the landing and shat onto the stairs below. He put a rolling pin through the t.v once because "everyone was milkin' Nirvana." Anyway, Nick hears this and he spins round on his arse and barks, "what d'ya wanna do that for? You're just an animal...like a cow." Guppy lifts his head, clears the hair from his face again, smiles and says, "right, but cows eat grass, yeh?" "Right," replies Nick and spins back round to dead-centre stereo field. Anyway, I watched as Guppy sat there for a while working things out in his head, then he peers up, red as beetroot, points to the speakers and says, "hear that bit?" And we both sat there nodding at each other and smiling for what seemed like minutes. There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennett

LOL Yan...your story is delightful. I'd like a bunch of friends like yours...in fact I think I had some slightly less extreme ones during my university days. Unfortunately, after years of hard work in a good job and pointless overtime done in order to remain competitive I am left with a bunch of soul-sucked, mind-fucked acquaintances who incessantly drone on about their mortgage, the price of petrol, fluctuations in the share market, the tax advantages of leasing a car over buying it outright, and why so-and-so doesn't deserve a promotion to chief drone.

I think that it is more a matter your approach to buying than to working that determines to what extent you will be yoked to the corporate machine. Those who feel they must have the newest, the highest-tech, the most status fulfilling goods will always be the ones who are slaves to the whims of the corporations, Their pride will never allow them to go on the dole, or even live in the woods. They would rather steal than not fit in to their little society of geeky snobs. The ones who answer to their inner spirit rather than peer pressure will always find the original solutions to living.

"Your good engineering jobs and the like are just as meaningless as those positions you deem lowly and meaningless. The only difference is that they pay a little more...for now." I'm sorry, but this is *truly* worthy of pity, if we're going to go about pitying one another. The dogged assumption that the only thing that separates different kinds of jobs from one another is money. Money doesn't make people happy, to a broad extent. But people can find different kinds of work very fulfilling. Some people, for example, might want to work for charities and companies that work to make things better - helping other people can be pretty fulfilling, you know. Other people might find work in a creative field that doesn't make much money more fulfilling. Others might like work that involves travel. Others still might end up working for themselves. Slackers don't get out of the system. They just prevent themselves from doing the work that they might get a kick out of by propogating the delusion that all work is exactly the same, equally meaningless and drab. And because they get no kick out of doing work, they will rely more on material objects for satisfaction - your games consoles, beer, DVD's etc. Personally, at the moment, I get far more pleasure and enjoyment from working on my different projects than I do from buying things (except maybe comics). Yeah, sure, I like beer and games too, but I don't spend all day aching to get back to them, because I'm usually getting something (not just money) out of whatever I'm doing. I like relaxing too - definitely - but spending all day doing sweet FA makes me depressed (haven't you heard? Exercise produces endorphins) so I try to get a balance. "Far from preventing you from breaking free from servitude it will only yoke you to it more through the lure of the rewards of perceived power, perceived control, wealth and status." Nope. What you don't seem to get is that if you can find work you enjoy doing, you just aren't 'lured' by these things - power, control etc. - because doing the work is the reward itself. As I say, you slackers are far more likely to be tempted by the promise of these things, because they all scream 'more for less' and that's what slacking is all about. How much can I bleed from the system for how little effort? I bet tonnes of company execs are slackers at heart. They're just clever slackers who've worked out that if they put in a bit of boot-licking work for a few years they can slack for cash, while hard-working people slave for them. "As for consumerism, it stands to reason those with the most income spend the most money..." Not necessarily. There's the example of a poor man spending more money on shoes because he can never afford to buy ones that last. But anyway, as I've already said, we're not talking about how much money you have - this is your blinkered assessment of what separates different jobs, and simply exemplifies why your attitude is the heart of consumerism - you just can't see anything beyond the money. ~ I'll Show You Tyrants * Fuselit * The Prowl Log * Woe's Woe

"Some people, for example, might want to work for charities and companies that work to make things better - helping other people can be pretty fulfilling, you know" I wanted to make this point yesterday, but didn't bother. I work for a charity. I'm not front line, but what I do tangibly leads to people being helped in situations that may have seemed hopeless for them. I work hard, for the most part, and enjoy it. I get paid well, but nowhere near what I would be paid for an equivalent private sector job. However, the effort I put in, the end product, the decent holidays and not having to wear any kind of suit or uniform are good reward for me and I'm happy with the situation. Since graduating and starting *proper* jobs (a career) I've only worked in the public and charity sector. It makes me happy for 2 reasons: 1. I feel like I'm doing something decent and 2. I feel I can bang on about the evils of jobs in marketing etc and take the moral high ground. If I were jobless and skint, I would take any old job in order to pay the rent. Nothing wrong with that. But through choice, I would always do the kind of job I've been doing for the past six years. I agree with almost everything JC has said in this case. Active engagement with what I am doing - be it working, writing, or yes, even just sitting around idly - keeps me happy. Just because you work hard, it doesn't make you a part of the 'capitalist machine'. Enzo.. Read my rubbish novel as it happens! http://somesolitude.wordpress.com/

This: http://www.amazon.co.uk/Hello-Laziness-Hard-Work-Doesnt/dp/0752871862/sr... is worth a read. It could obviously have been a slightly better book if the author had put in a bit more effort but it is a good defence of laziness, as opposed to working enthusiastically in an unfulfilling job with a big corporation. As Jack and Enzo point out, though, that kind of critique doesn't tell us anything much about the value or otherwise of working hard if you're in the position to work on things - either for money or pleasure - that you do think have some value.

I don't think anyone means to discredit working hard for what makes you happy. I think what people are attacking is the negative view of idleness that seems to prevail in our society. Those who refuse to join in the 'work force' are condemmed as lazy. Maybe some of them are but, many just want to enjoy life. These people don't feel they need a career to define themselves by, indeed they don't feel the need to define themselves at all. They just want to be. And this doesn't necessarily mean sitting at home drinking beer and watching telly. If Henry David Throeau tried his Walden experiment now he would probably be laughed at and called a loser, unless he had a grant from the government and a publicity agent.

You are indeed an oracle xman...for me the entire Western conformist view leaves little for complete emancipation. To do as we truly wish...as long as others were were not hurt or harmed of course. In school we are conditioned with uniformity and conformity and then programmed to be easily absorbed into the insatiable fiscal monster which perpetuates the nightmare...you need the nice house in the nice suburb...you need the latest car...you need this and you need that...and you can become indentured to the banks as they will lend you the money to grab your niche in the land of milk and honey, and you'll need to kiss butt and do what you can to hold on to your dream job. In the process one makes so many compromises that one gets lost in the fog...nah, I'd prefer to let the stampeding herd jockey for pole position and stress about mortgage rates, interest rates, petrol prices...I'll potter on at my own muddling pace and continue to observe the herd with bemusement...

Mr Cade you seem to be the one with all the pity. I was arguing that many people work hard and buy into the work ethic regardless of their job title or status. Whilst I would wager there are more people who work hard in jobs they do not love, I'm not denying that there are people who love what they do be it street sweeper or doctor. However, If one loves what one does it becomes a pleasure and ceases to be hard work. I think it was Confucius who said... "Choose a job you love, and you will never have to work a day in your life." Laziness/idleness also fits into the picture in that it is very difficult, luck aside, to discover that love if one is always working hard. You however appear to be arguing that anyone who doesn't work in a job they love is lazy. Choosing to discover what you love and then pursuing that love has more to do with courage than with industriousness.

Good points slothful! Mr.Cade, what are your views on 'sickies' ? Are you a workaholic? I pulled another sickie today (which I won't be paid for unfortunately) and while i was lying in bed watching the cricket a rare event occurred...a thought flashed through my mind...why not offer philanthropic workaholics the opportunity to sponsor idlers? Brilliant! The benefactors could get little reports on what joys the idlers experienced instead of being in their purgatories...I am prepared to be the first idler to sign up for this...

Ooh! I like that idea Mr Bludger. I know quite a few people (including siblings) who are stressed out in the upper echelons of corporations and feeling lousy about it. I think this would give them a chance to contribute to a good cause, where they could hear instant results of their largesse and be entertained at the same time. Their souls need us! Let's investigate this on ebay, shall we...?

Yes xman perhaps that could be an option if the workaholics here fail to show any enthusiasm for the concept. Utopia would be attainable if we idlers could be liberated from the pressure of having to procure money for the essentials... It would be very encouraging if this idea catches on and the rift between idlers and strivers could be narrowed. Come on you workaholics...cast aside your cynicism and embrace enlightenment! Think of the merry idlers blossoming as a direct result of your benevolence...the love will flourish and we can all be happy!

There's no disputing that I'd be happy if I were to land myself oodles of free cash. But I wouldn't kid myself into believing that it's gonna solve my problems or that it's a state of grace with any permanence. There's just as much chance of my wife becoming a bitch and cheating on me as there was before. There's just as much chance of me getting an incurable disease. There's still the possibility of my daughter getting flattened by a ride-on lawnmower. There's the possibility of attracting some many leeches into my life that I'd lose sight of who were real friends and who weren't. There are a myriad of new psychological, emotional, political and social problems that come with the change in lifestyle. There's all the new land, new gadgets and shit to maintain. There's the burden of choosing which exclusive escourt(s) to entertain of a weekend. But who could deny that a person living in a capitalist society would not benefit from an injection of free cash? Money or no money, same old shit happens to everybody. Just those with cash might get to suffer a little more comfortably. One day I might be thankful that some millionaire has invested cash into scientific research because that research may be exploited by technologists and may well save my life. Fair enough - there are positive aspects to it all. Personally, though, whilst being thankful and appreciative of others' virtues and strengths, I wish others would respect my desire for a simple life of tea, lentil dhal, space-jazz and staring into the distance. crick cracked DNA whilst off his head on acid. Jesus abstained and brought back some wisdom. There's a chance that I might benefit mankind by dipping my lip and fiddling with my willy. There's nothing more mind-teasing than the incomprehensible eagerly avowed - Dennett

You are a fine fellow Yan! If only your philosophy could be adopted by the masses of deluded fools who spend their lives in slavery to the work ethic. So sad. I am rather disappointed with the lack of interest by the workaholics in my sponsorship idea...perhaps they are working back...deadlines and all that kinda shit...