Listening to the News 2/3/22

Gold cherry
Poem of the week

By Di_Hard

Wed, 02 Mar 2022
  • 7391 reads
36 comments
 

Does sound of our clapping drown out

the bombs exploding in your homes?

Our politicians stand shoulder

to shoulder with ambassadors

come to beg for help, receiving

words of Solidarity, bright

in Democracy's safest seats

 

and promises breaking as walls

break in your land, hoping courage

rubs off. Our hands, white feathers, hide

mouths whispering "We will not fight"

or eagerly sign cheques for schools

if anyone is left to learn

there is no honour, in the West

 

 

 

Certificate U
Poem
Rant

Comments

Submitted by airyfairy on

Thank you for posting this, Di. My heart bleeds for those poor people in Ukraine, but I am aware of a weariness as I watch 'our leaders' responding and I make bets with myself that when it's 'all over' we shall find a way to accommodate whoever stands beside or in place of Putin. Having said that, I admit that yes, I am afraid that we might be drawn into a wider conflict, and I know I am one of those with a white feather. We need to at least be honest with ourselves. I also wish I didn't believe that even as sanctions are put in place, arrangements are being made for financial escape tunnels for certain people. 

However, I swear, if I hear Ben Wallace say one more time 'Britain is leading the way in...' whatever it is, my Incredible Hulk may take over. 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thanks Airy. The more I hear about this the worse it gets. Have you heard about the Budapest Memorandum? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Budapest_Memorandum_on_Security_Assurances

"The Budapest Memorandum on Security Assurances refers to ...the accession of Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine to the Treaty on the Non-Proliferation of Nuclear Weapons (NPT). The memorandum was originally signed by three nuclear powers: the Russian Federation, the United Kingdom and the United States. China and France gave somewhat weaker individual assurances in separate documents.[1]

The memorandum included security assurances against threats or use of force against the territorial integrity or political independence of Ukraine, Belarus, and Kazakhstan. As a result of other agreements and the memorandum, between 1993 and 1996, Belarus, Kazakhstan and Ukraine gave up their nuclear weapons.[2]"

 

I am SO ASHAMED

 

Submitted by airyfairy on

No, I didn't know that. I am not surprised. 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

I can perfectly understand not wanting to take on Russia, however if we did not intend to do that, we should not have said we would.  And then, when they ask us to honour our word and come to their assistance, we give them applause and say how brave they are, to fight on their own. As well as saying, Oh, if you were in Nato, it would be different, when they have been trying to join Nato for decades!

 

Submitted by David Kirtley on

Good poem. You aptly sum up the inevitable hypocrisy of our 'support' when western nations don't feel it wise to join their defence and trigger a wider war.

Submitted by David Kirtley on

Maybe if western nations had agreed that Ukraine would be restricted from ever joining NATO or the EU the invasion could have been avoided? That might well have been a better solution than the current situation where Putin can sit on parts of the Ukraine, if not all eventually, for ever. But can he be trusted?  Maybe it is better to turn the screws and see if he eventually loses power?

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Yes! That is what I understand. I am guessing that Trump withdrawing from the Intermediate Range Nuclear Forces Treaty in 2018 must have sent a very bad signal to Russia

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Intermediate-Range_Nuclear_Forces_Treaty#:....

If that is the case, the best that can be hoped for is that the damage from that shortsightedness can be undone with a  new IRNF  treaty, plus as you say, making it clear that Ukraine will not join Nato, before all hope for Ukraine as a democracy is taken. I wonder if after all the clapping, the ambassadors were told to advise a quick surrender to minimise casualties. Thankyou very much for reading, and your thoughtful comment

 

Submitted by marandina on

It's a difficult one. When and how to intervene on a military level. Maybe the Russians will finally get the message. Soon, I hope.

https://amp.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2022/mar/03/vladimir-putin-ukr...

 

Submitted by Ewan on

is that our armed forces are not up to contributing to a coalition force at the same level as that which went to Iraq. Or indeed to Afghanistan. This is fine. Limiting defence spending to sufficient to defend the realm is sensible. Just don't expect to be able to mount an expeditionary force.

The problem is taking the Russians at face value from 1992 onwards. The Russian mind-set is such that all is fair if it is in the interests of Mother Russia. This has been true through the days of Imperial Russia and the Soviets and it is no different now. The withdrawal of troops from Germany was a big mistake, as was the assumption that a land war would never be fought again on the soil of Europe.

There are two possible reasons for hope,

1. Putin is 69 and looks ill. (This is a two-edged sword, nothing to lose and a legacy to leave, even if that means nuclear winter).

2. The oligarchs are rich because of corruption, clever investment and selling gas and oil to the west, who are busy running down their extraction of fossil fuels, but their use of them not so much. Sanctions and blowing the earth to smithereens won't make the oligarchs more money, so they won't have them/it.

Meanwhile, people are dying. It's shit, but it's as much our fault as the Moscow Madman's.

Anyway, this is one of the best poems I've read about all this mess. Well done, Di_Hard.

 

Author Page at the 'Zon
 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thankyou for your comment Paul, and for the article link which was very interesting. I remember when Gorbachev became President and asked for aid, the kind of aid given to the countries he had allowed to become independent from the Soviet Union. We didn't give him anything. We sent companies over there to exploit their resources and called it partnerships. I wonder if we had treated the Russians as liberated people in search of support in finding a new way, just the same as those in Hungary, Poland etc, that the army and oligarchs would not have ended up in control?

I don't know what I'm talking about. Putin would terrify me. I would probably pass out just sniffing real Russian Vodka :0) As a namby pamby ignoramus I cannot understand why we lied to the Ukrainians saying we would support them if they gave up their nuclear weapons, and then continued to lie to them saying we were going to let them join NATO, when we knew if we did it would provoke what has happened anyway. If we had been honest with them, they would have made different, pragmatic decisions and would not be facing the threat of Kiev being surrounded and flattened, as someone said was happening in Kharkiv last night, as a lesson to the people for what was to come. I do hope your son comes home, soon!

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thankyou very much Ewan, for your informative reply and very kind comment. I think countries must always act in their own best interests, or rather believe that they are? Russia is no different. I don't understand the morality of a lot of the things America does in South America? Or Israel does. Or what Britain did while giving ourselves the title Great. I believe we have used the peace as a crutch, to prop up our withering humanity while capitalism causes climate change and such huge wealth inequality that tax based society must soon collapse. Democracy is fake so long as lobbying and donations to political parties exist. If I was about to be made homeless due to floods caused by rich countries who consider themselves to have the moral highground now, I might struggle to understand the difference?

 

Submitted by Insertponceyfre... on

I completely missed this poem earlier Di.

I was talking to someone yesterday (who knows about these things) who said there is actually a lot more help going on behind the scenes while we in the west loudly talk about not being able to help. I do hope that (non)help does eventually help as much as it can

The budapest memorandum doesn't count because they all had their fingers crossed behind their backs when it was agreed. 

Did you ever watch The Death of Stalin by Armando Iannucci? If not, do try to. So much of what's happening now reminds me of it - they cast a Sid James lookalike as Stalin which was a stroke of utter genius and I can't watch Putin without thinking of him

Hope you're feeling slightly better now!

 

Submitted by Insertponceyfre... on

I agree with Ewan - this is one of the best. It's our Poem of the Week - congratulations!

It's also our Facebook and Twitter Pick of the Day

Please share/retweet far and wide

Picture Credit:https://tinyurl.com/3v538cek

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thankyou! 

And thankyou for saying about people trying to help, I hope it works soon

 

Submitted by lenchenelf on

"there is no honour in the west" 

I don't believe honour has a bearing for most modern military strategy. Sadly, I think  it's going to be about who, in global terms, comes out on top as an economic power, with the very poorest taking the hit, as per.

But I'm gloomy

best

Lena

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thankyou for reading and your comment, Lena, I think your poem last week is brilliant

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thankyou for reading and commenting, Trevor. It is good to have another point of view. I often seem to have a different understanding of things to those around me. I find politics and economics very interesting but have zero interaction with the real world and get all my information from Radio 4 and the World Service? 

This poem was just my imagining how I would feel if I heard all the clapping while hiding in a bomb shelter, freezing and afraid, my child hungry. Or standing in a familiar street holding the unfamiliar weight of a gun, afraid of having to use it. I do not know the answers. I do not know how anyone outside Ukraine will live with themselves if Kiev is surrounded and flattened. Were you aware that in several theoretical military excerises Putin had resolved the issue by (theoretically) striking Poland with nuclear bombs? If that did happen, should we still not intervene, incase that triggered bombing Germany? Putting pressure on the Russian people who face imprisonment or much worse for protesting and great hardship either way, does not seem right

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thankyou for your reply :0) I am guessing many feel the same as you.

 

ps.

On Radio 4's PM today, about half way through, former RAF Commander Greg Bagwell suggested it would be possible for the UN to set up a no-fly zone?

https://www.bbc.co.uk/programmes/m001540m

He also suggested that Putin might be considering the West's sanctions as an act of aggression? Am not sure how wise it is continually to give way, or where does it stop?

 

Submitted by Penny4athought on

This is what great poetry does- it opens up the marketplace of ideas and encourages discussion, and your intense poem has done that, I've learned so much from reading all the varying comments and found myself agreeing and disagreeing in varying degrees but most important, I came away with an understanding that I lacked before this reading, So thank you Di-Hard for posting this powerful poem.

Penny4athought

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Oh! Thankyou so much for your comment! I am very glad if you found all the links interesting. And the very knowledgable comments from other readers :0) 

 

Submitted by littleditty on

Dont know what to say! The emotions many feel are all there in your poem - no need for my lists of them, or speeches. A poem does not have to give answers, solutions or fix anything. Good poem Di xx

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Thankyou :0) That is just as well, as the more I learn about it the more complicated it becomes! Thankyou for reading an commenting, I hope you are well and writing more of your beautiful poems soon

 

Submitted by catherine poarch on

I'm so glad I found time to come on ABC today. This is so good, Di. So succinct and honest. Democracy's safest seats struck home. And the last lines - nail on the head. I wish the Cabinet would read it although to be honest and fair, they are incapacitated by thick layers of protective blubber.

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Catherine! Am so glad to see you as been wanting to tell you the person I gave your book to for Christmas loves it! I knew they would, because would have the sensibility of a string of spaghetti not to, but thought would let you know, and say Thankyou for giving me the perfect present choice :0)

Was partly thinking still of the Chagos Islands when writing the last line

Thankyou so much for reading and commenting, and I hope you are well :0)

 

Submitted by catherine poarch on

Thanks for all of that, Di. That's so lovely. 

Am going to try and work out how to send you a message so you can have my email address. Might take some brain power. Always nice to chat to any of you on here. smiley

And again - great poem.

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

Am sorry, my message bit doesn't work, could try messaging you?

 

Submitted by Insertponceyfre... on

butting in to offer to send you both each others' email addresses if you like? Apologies for the messaging glitch. Let me know if you want me to

 

Submitted by catherine poarch on

yes please, that would be great. I couldn't even find the messaging thing although I know I've seen it in the past! Thanks a lot.

 

PS - I think Di has managed to make it work!

 

Submitted by Insertponceyfre... on

oh ok - well it's good that it's working!

 

Submitted by Di_Hard on

wwwwwwwwwwwwww22wwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwwww (Tina message, probably about tech incompetance of nearby human) Thankyou! I did the Contact thing on Catherine's page and it worked fine :0)

 

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